Grace Amidst the Struggle: Finding Peace
Guest: Jo Roper
Jo is an obstetric and gynaecology doctor who is married to Mark Roper, the leader of Fabric Church, Manchester (a plant of HTB) which she is also part of the leadership team for.
Jo’s parents had a long wait for children and this is part of the reason this issue has been laid on her heart. Although infertility has not been a personal issue she has faced, she has been alongside many of her close friends in the fertility journey and feels passionate about supporting and praying for people who are.
Jo now also helps to co-lead Waiting for Children - an HTB-led six week online course specifically designed to support christian couples facing challenges with fertility.
Here’s a summary of this week’s story:
In a world that often feels like it’s spinning out of control, finding peace can seem like a herculean task. But what if peace is not something to be found in the absence of struggle, but rather something to be embraced amidst it? Despite not having personally experienced infertility, Jo has been deeply moved by the struggles of those around her. Her journey is a testament to finding peace and purpose in the midst of life's most challenging circumstances.
The Quest for Peace in Uncertainty
Jo's life story is marked by significant moments of uncertainty and change, not unlike the struggles of those dealing with infertility. She speaks candidly about not being particularly good at handling uncertainty and change. Yet, she underscores a profound truth: in moments of doubt and unpredictability, peace can still be a steadfast companion.
The Power of Faith
It is in the middle of life's storms that Jo has learned to lean into her faith. One of her favourite verses from the Psalms, "seek peace and pursue it," captures the essence of her approach to life. This pursuit of peace isn't a passive waiting but an active journey, often requiring a deep dive into faith.
Grace in the Midst of Struggle
Jo’s story is not just about finding peace; it's about discovering grace amidst the struggle. She talks about how God has managed to keep her going, even when she felt overwhelmed by the changes around her. This grace isn't just a soothing balm for the wounds of life; it is the strength to move forward.
Empathy Through Shared Experiences
There's a shared thread of experience in Jo’s narrative that resonates deeply. Whether it’s dealing with infertility or navigating other life changes, the feelings of uncertainty, waiting, and hoping are universal. Jo's story is a reminder that in our shared human experiences, there's a wellspring of empathy and understanding.
Invitation to a Journey of Faith
Jo’s insights are an invitation to all of us to view our struggles through the lens of faith. Her journey encourages us to embrace grace and find peace, even when the path ahead seems uncertain. It’s about trusting that, in the midst of our struggles, there is a peace that can calm our troubled waters and a grace that can carry us through.
Remember, in the journey of life, grace and peace are not just companions; they are our guides.
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Sadaf Beynon: Hey there and welcome to What's the Story. We're an inquisitive bunch of hosts from the What's the Story team on a mission to uncover stories about faith and courage from everyday people. In doing that, we get the privilege of chatting with amazing guests and have the opportunity to delve into their faith journey, the hurdles they've overcome, and the life lessons they have learned along the way.
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church. They would love to connect with you. And now, let's meet your host and our special guest for today.
Anna Kettle: Hi there and welcome to another episode of What's The Story Podcast. I'm Anna Kettle, your host for today, and today I'm joined by Jo Roper, who is an Obs and Gynae doctor. Now Jo is married to Mark, who's the leader of Fabric Church, which is an HTB plant, and she's also part of the leadership team for the church too.
Jo's parents had a long way For children, and this is part of the reason that she's so passionate about this subject. Although infertility has not been a personal issue that she's faced, she's been alongside many close friends in their fertility journey and feels passionate about supporting and praying for people who are going through that.
issue. Jo now also hopes to co lead Waiting for Children, which is an HTB led six week online course specifically designed to support Christian families facing challenges with fertility of all kinds. Jo, thank you so much for joining us on the [00:02:00] podcast today. It's lovely to see you.
Jo Roper: Thank you. Thanks so much for having me.
Anna Kettle: Oh, it's great to see you. So, um, I suppose we should probably start a little bit, um, at the beginning of your story, Jo, because we need to talk about, uh, I know you're going to talk a little bit about fertility, because that's something you are very passionate about and you work in. Um, but yeah, let's start at the beginning of your story, because that kind of interweaves, doesn't it?
Like, yeah, we touched on it in your bio there, and your parents had some difficulties with having children.
Jo Roper: Yeah, they had, um, unexplained infertility and, um, They were told, well, it wasn't completely unexplained, they had some, some issues on both sides, um, mum and dad. And so, um, they were told that they would never be able to conceive themselves.
Um, and obviously prayed a lot about that, um, and, and waited for five years basically. Um, and then yeah, miraculously had me, which was [00:03:00] very good for me. Um, and, um, I think. Having been told that story lots of times, I mean, they made leaflets to give out to every single person they knew, um, there's still leaflets flying around that get, get brought out every now and again with a picture of me on, um, they were just so, so grateful and they just wanted to tell everyone, um, how great God was and, um, how thankful they were basically.
So I think that kind of. It's just kind of started in me that kind of feeling that this is something that people go through and it's a really big deal. Um, um, so yeah, I think that's like, that's the start of it, um, for me.
Anna Kettle: Yeah, that's amazing. Um, and you're, are you their only child?
Jo Roper: And they did actually go on and have my brother as well.
So there's two of us. Wow.
Anna Kettle: Yeah. So definitely. Presumably like. Lots of hoping and praying and years of waiting and yeah, children, which was amazing. Um, [00:04:00] so, um, obviously you grew up in a Christian family then, you've like alluded to that faith was kind of a big part of your family. So tell us a bit more about your sort of early life, kind of.
you know, how did, obviously you've grown up in that Christian context, has faith always been important? Like, what, what points have
Jo Roper: come into play? Yeah, yeah, so certainly my parents would, you know, took us to church and, and, and just kind of gave us that, um, all the, all that they felt basically, all their, um, they kind of, Taught us and, um, guided us.
Um, but obviously I think it was really obvious as well that they were, it was important to them that we decided ourselves. Um, and yeah, I think. Most of the time I would have been happy to go to church. Um, and then really it was the year after my, after I finished school. Um, so my gap year before I went to uni, um, I spent, uh, six months living on a mercy ship in West Africa.
Um, [00:05:00] and. That's obviously a Christian organization, I'd chosen to go there, um, but I think that was probably the first time that I'd had a very individual faith and made those decisions myself to keep on following, keep on, um, yeah, praying and, and spending time with Jesus. So I think that was really formational in, um, in my faith journey, really, um, and I think that was just a great way to go into uni.
I think having had that experience already of being on my own, but living in a Christian environment and being encouraged, um, was really important. Um,
Anna Kettle: Yeah, I imagine, um, I imagine being on something like Mercy Ships is quite transformative, especially as, obviously, you've gone on to train as a doctor, and practice as a doctor, so I imagine was that quite an important part of your journey as well?
Jo Roper: Yeah, so I'd already chosen to do medicine, I had already got a place at med school, um, but yeah, I was just so keen to experience anything medical, um, and it was just a fantastic place to see some [00:06:00] amazing Life's transformed, but also with the, you know, spreading the love of Jesus as well at the same time, which was Brilliant.
Um, and so I think I, yeah, I just loved it and was so excited to start training and to be able to go and do stuff like that in the future. Yeah, that's
Anna Kettle: fab. And then obviously you did, you did go on and do that in the future and still doing it as well, like church planting and all sorts of stuff. So, um, yeah, it's obviously the start of quite a, you know, cool journey with God.
Yeah. Yeah. Um, but one of, one of the, um. Obviously, we've touched on it, but one of the really big passions you've got, you know, often people come on here and talk about challenges that they've faced personally, and I think, um, I'm sure you have to, you know, faced various challenges, but one of the things you're really passionate about is this whole area of fertility, you know, you work to support people as an obs and gynae doctor, you're going through fertility, and obviously you've [00:07:00] touched that, that's been a personal story in your own family as well.
And, um, also you're so passionate about supporting other people with it. So can you tell us a bit more about, about that kind of journey? How did that become a thing? And how did you do that both as a doctor and pastorally?
Jo Roper: Yeah, so in Obs and Gynae, um, I spend a very small amount of my time doing fertility work.
It's, it's, yeah, it's not sort of the main part of my job, um, but actually it's probably mostly three friends that, um, I've been alongside people who've been through that journey. And I think you can just see how it's, yeah, it breaks people, um, and it's all consuming and, um. And so I think going through that with friends and just trying my best to support, I just felt like I wanted to do something even more.
Um, and it was actually at New Wine, [00:08:00] um, nearly five years ago now, I went to a seminar, uh, for Couples With Infertility, um, led by Saltwater and Honey, and, um, it was them talking about a support group that someone at their Bible college had set up, and, um, they said, oh, it was a lady who hadn't been through this journey and just wanted to support people, and I think that was what I'd always felt was that I was a bit disqualified from doing much more because I hadn't personally experienced it, and I didn't want anyone to feel that I, yeah, I didn't really know what they were going through because I really don't.
And so it was them almost giving the permission to say, well, it doesn't matter if you've got that heart, you can do something. Um, and so I came back to HTTP where we were at the time, um, and spoke to someone and said, what can I do? And it turned out there was a course that had already been written. Um, by another couple, Alex and Rebecca Stewart, many years ago, [00:09:00] who'd been through an infertility journey.
They'd written Waiting for Children and run the course themselves and then, and then left HDB and, and no one else had picked it up. So no, it hadn't been run for a while. Um, and so I thought, great, the material's already there. I don't need to even sit down and do much. I just need to run it. Um, and so that's when we started running Waiting for Children.
Um, That's cool. And so yeah, it's just, it's just, it's something that God has just laid on my heart. And I think when we talk about God breaking your heart for, for, for people group or for a certain, you know, certain thing, that's what he's done with this for me because I, I just, yeah, just want to do something.
Anna Kettle: Yeah, that's, that's so cool because, I mean, I think there are a few things in churches now but I still think it's quite, I think a lot of churches are quite poorly resourced on this whole area and when you think, like, it's something like one in [00:10:00] four. Couples go through miscarriage and one in seven maybe through infertility struggles of some kind and that's a lot of people in everyone's congregation right that are affected by this issue at some point um yeah and it feels like there aren't that many resources and and there isn't that much good Teaching about this subject really in a lot of churches still, so such a valuable resource and if anybody's interested in finding out a bit more about it or coming along to the course, I mean, can you tell us a bit more about it?
Like what does
Jo Roper: it involve? Yeah, so, um, so actually because we started in lockdown, we started it online and actually we've continued that way. I think we found that it makes it accessible to anyone. Um, we've had People from all across the world, um, mostly across the UK, but yeah, um, some people from abroad joining.
Um, and, and it makes it a little bit anonymous as well. I think people can decide whether they want to put their names on [00:11:00] the screen or whether they want to put their camera on that kind of thing. And I think that that just makes it more accessible. I think people feel able to come along, which is great.
Um, So yeah, so it's an online course, um, we, so we run it through HDB usually once a year now and then there's another, um, almost identical course running online through another church in Oxford. Um, and so basically we've had. Yeah, a range between sort of 10 or 40 couples on each course. Um, we have five weeks, um, covering, um, the effect on couples, infertility treatments, adoption, um, Something we call Living Fruitfully, so essentially, potentially living without children, um, and then dealing with loss.
Um, and each week we have a couple who come and share their story on that particular subject. Um, and Yeah, and [00:12:00] I think that's probably the, the amazing part of the most amazing part of the course is that, you know, it's people just being completely real, what they've been through, how they dealt with it, how it affected their marriage, how it affected their faith.
Um, and just an encouragement, I think, hopefully. Um, and then. Similar to the marriage course, we have just a few spaces for the couples to speak within their couple. So, um, you pose a question and then give them five, ten minutes to talk about it between themselves. In a way, just to encourage them to actually make.
Let's have some of those difficult conversations, I think, because, yeah, it's not going to be something you typically sit down at the end of day and think, okay, let's have that really difficult conversation. So it's like, okay, well, we've got the space now. Um, and, and yeah, that's kind of the, that's the, the, the course.
Anna Kettle: Yeah, that sounds, it sounds a really valuable resource that I'm sure some people listening will [00:13:00] either want to access themselves or know people who might find it helpful to access. So, just to say we will include all the information about how you can find out more or register for the next course kind of on the show notes as well, um, so we'll include that at the end of the podcast.
Um, but you also have like, so that, that's one area that you're serving this kind of group, but then you also more recently have had a bit more of a personal way that you've supported a friend who's been through years of infertility as well, haven't you? Can you tell us a bit more about
Jo Roper: that as well?
Yeah, so, um, A really close friend of mine, um, from school, so we knew each other at secondary school and then we went to university together and she ended up needing a hysterectomy because she had cancer, um, and so obviously wasn't going to be able to carry her own children, um. And so actually when she got married, um, me and my husband offered that we could carry their child if they wanted [00:14:00] to, um, she still had her ovaries, so, um, it was completely genetically their child, um, and I carried it for them, so that was, um, that was nearly four years ago that they got married and we started that, that process, um, and then, um, Yeah, it was, it was a very interesting thing to go through.
I think like it was absolutely amazing experience. Um, I think going through some of the IVF process kind of made it even more real to me what other people have to go through. Um, obviously I think I came at it from a very different way. It was, it was a physical thing I was going through, not so much, not so much an emotional thing.
Obviously I cared, but it wasn't personally for me. And, and yeah, so, um, yeah, baby Phoebe was born in February this year, um, and she's wonderful. Her parents are very happy. Um, we, yeah, thankfully it was a very straightforward pregnancy [00:15:00] and it was just, I think it's just an amazing experience to go through.
I think I. I kind of knew that I probably would go into it in a very different way from my own, carrying my own children. Um, I'm quite a black and white thinker, so, um, you know, things are good or bad, things are easy or hard. Um, and, and I kind of knew that I would just go into this like, I know that I'm doing this for her and I never wanted another baby.
And so, you know, this is a gift for them. Yeah, it was, it was wonderful, um, and I think it's been a brilliant way for us to explain to our children what people go through and, um, and just to bring up this conversation with people, um, who might not know about it. Yeah. I
Anna Kettle: mean, that is, to me, that is an amazing gift to give to someone, like what an incredible gift to give to a friend that, you know, because that, that is.
Although [00:16:00] obviously they've been through a lot with, you know, years of not thinking they could have children, but obviously there's a personal cost there for you that's pretty big as well. Like carrying a baby for someone else is no small thing. Like it's not, it don't, being a donor is becoming more common, but it's still not super common isn't it?
Like I don't know anyone else in my personal life who's done that, so it's still relatively rare. And I think basically giving up your life. your body, at least. Yeah, for someone else, isn't it? I mean
Jo Roper: Yeah, I think it was so, it was interesting, we had a couple on Waiting for Children who talked about, um, using a surrogate, so, so they couldn't carry their children, so they, they had a surrogate, um, and she described it really well, actually, she just said it's, it's a grace that God gives these people to do this, and I do totally feel that, I, I think, I, I know that God gave me the grace to, to do that, and it didn't, It just didn't feel like a huge thing for me to [00:17:00] do.
Um, and yeah, you know, there were bits that were difficult and there were bits that, um, you know, I was a bit fed up by the end of carrying, carrying, carrying a baby. Um, but, but I think it just, it was. Yeah, it was, it was kind of just always what I felt I wanted to do and, um, it was interesting when I brought it up with my husband, he said, Oh, I thought you might want to do that.
That's interesting,
Anna Kettle: did he? Yeah. And was Mark always on board with that as well, or did it take him a bit longer, or were you both on the same page? Yeah, I think he,
Jo Roper: I mean. He, he's very, he's got a very good understanding of me. Um, and so I think, yeah, when he said, I thought you might want to do that. I think probably he had probably already started preparing himself for it as well.
He said that I, um, generally when I've got something into my head that I want to do, there's not much that anyone else can do to stop me. Um, and I think obviously he [00:18:00] completely realized the. the reasons behind it and was completely supportive of that. Um, obviously he was concerned about my health and things like that, but, um, Again, I think, I mean, he used to be a doctor as well, so I think having that kind of medical understanding as well, um, you're a little bit able to more rationalize it and kind of be like, well, actually the majority of these things go okay and, um, yeah, so I think being able to do that and, and then also obviously having faith and being able to, to pray over me and the baby and everything, the whole process just, yeah, we were given peace about it.
Anna Kettle: Yeah, I think what you said before about how there's a real grace in God when he calls you to do something. I think that's really true and I suppose it's true for any area of our life actually, isn't it? That actually when God calls you to do something, even if it's something that sounds difficult to other people, like there's a grace for you to do it because God's asked you to and he'll give you the tools and the help that [00:19:00] you need.
So yeah, I think that must be really true. And also Jo, you sort of strike me as someone who's pretty up for a challenge anyway, um, I mean, you've also just moved from, you know, kind of the outskirts of London to Manchester to a new church for HDP, so, I mean, you strike me as someone who's up for a challenge and I'd love to hear a bit more about that as well actually.
Yeah,
Jo Roper: that's it. That has been another thing that that that's probably been like, um, another huge challenge in the last few years. So, um, so as I sort of just mentioned, Mark was a doctor as well. So we both trained in Birmingham, lived in Birmingham for almost 10 years, um, working as doctors, um, had our first two children and, um, And it had kind of always been on our radar that Mark might be called to ministry, um, but we didn't know quite how that would happen or how that would look.
Um, and, and then [00:20:00] yes, it all became kind of a bit more obvious. And, um, so he started training, um, in St. Mellitus in London. That was in, that was the same year, um, that our twins were born. So that was 2015. And so he was commuting one day a week to London to train. And again, we just had no idea what was going to happen at the end of that, but we kind of trusted, um, God had already provided amazing things for us, like childcare that we could afford while we were both working part time and all that kind of thing.
Um, and so. We got to the end of the three years of training and again, we're trying to work out how this is all going to work out and God, um, very clearly called us to London, um, which was unexpected. And, um, so we had this kind of. A few months of trying to work out how this was going to work in our lives, how was my job going to work, how was, you know, housing and children and all [00:21:00] that kind of stuff.
And that was when God really taught me about, you know, if I've called you to something, I'll sort out all the details and you have to just go. And so, yeah, so we went to London and, um, and all the details fell into place. Some of them not till we got there, but, um, it was just amazing to see. the way that, yeah, God was sorting everything.
And then, um, and then we moved within London, so that after two years we moved on to the site of HTB, um, which was again another kind of, is this really what we need to do? But it was the right thing and it all was fine. Um, and then we actually knew from when we moved to London that we probably wouldn't be there long term.
And there was this talk of Manchester and, and that kind of grumbled along with COVID and how was that going to work? And there weren't any buildings and that kind of thing, um, for a church in Manchester. Um, and so. Again, we kind of knew that we were [00:22:00] coming and it was, it was completely uncertain how it was all going to work out, um, but very clear that that's what God wanted us to do.
So, um, we had found a building that we wanted to buy, um, But there were complications with it and we needed to get things approved by the council to be able to buy it. So we moved to Manchester in July. We didn't have a building, um, to start a church in. Um, we've been meeting in a nightclub, which has been really fun.
Um. And, and actually, yeah, all the stuff for the council came through in, I think it was September. Um, and we have now bought the building, um, and we're hoping to move in, um, in the, in the new year. So I think just part of that has just made me trust God so much more. Each time we've moved, each time it's been uncertain, I think I've been able to look back and be like.
God has sorted it out before, so I've got to trust and [00:23:00] has given me peace in the moment. Um, yeah, most of the time. I'm not, I'm not a particularly good person with uncertainty and change, um, but, but God has managed to, to keep me going.
Anna Kettle: Yeah. And it seems to me that, like, quite often when we're not good, and I don't think many of us are very good at, like, uncertainty and living in limbo, but it actually strikes me that, like, Yeah, kind of, God asks us to do that quite a lot, to keep kind of moving and journeying with him.
Um, it strikes me that, that's, I don't know, there's not that, you know, there's some certain parallels there with living with infertility as well, isn't there, but it's like an uncertainty and they're living in limbo in that as well, so again, I think there's this kind of empathy even in other areas.
Because uncertainty is hard in any area of life, isn't it, living like that? Yeah, totally.
Jo Roper: Yeah,
Anna Kettle: definitely. Yeah, but um, yeah, I mean, I, yeah, I, I love, I love that you guys have done that [00:24:00] and, you know, again, we'll put all the details of Fabric Church, um, in the show notes because if anyone's in or near Manchester and is interested in checking you guys out.
Yeah, please come And um, tell us a bit more about, tell us just a little bit more about the church, then kind of what are you guys up to, like what's kind of your focus
Jo Roper: or? Yeah, so we um, we have like a congregation that seems to be so varied, it's amazing, um, so we've got lots of students, um, lots of young adults, I mean the city centre is just There's accommodation going up everywhere, um, high rises of flats and student accommodation and stuff.
So there's loads and loads of young people living in the city centre at the moment, and even more to come. Um, so yeah, we've got loads of them. And then some families, we've got some children, um, And yeah, it's just, it's just really exciting. We've, um, we've already got, um, a student [00:25:00] pastor who's working with students, which is amazing.
Um, we've got a kids worker, um, and we're just kind of, yeah, we've been kind of growing slowly over the, yeah, we've been running 11 or 12 weeks now. And, um, just trying to work out exactly how we can use our building the best, basically. It's just on the edge of the, um, the ring road, um, in Manchester, um, like eight minutes walk from Piccadilly station.
Um, and it's got loads and loads of space where we're going to work. Slowly through it, none of it is actually usable initially, um, but we're kind of transforming some of it so we can move in initially and then over, there's a plan for over the next few years to kind of do all the other bits, um, but yeah, we're just trying to work out how we can, um, serve that community, um, use, use the space, um, to help them during the week.
Um, we've been running Alpha at a skate park, which is pretty cool, um, just really close to where the building is as [00:26:00] well. Um, and we've got Beer and Carols on Thursday which will be really fun as well. So yeah, we're kind of just working out how to do things to help the community around us at the moment.
Anna Kettle: That sounds great, sounds really great and definitely check it out if you're in the area. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I honestly, we kind of keep talking about all of this for ages, couldn't we? But I suppose, sort of like pulling it all together then, um, what would you say, kind of, because we've talked a bit about change and talked about fertility and supporting people who are going through that and talked a bit about kind of, um, yeah, kind of trusting God in the middle of all that kind of unknowingness of life and, and change.
But like, what would you say is kind of, The one big lesson or, like, life motto that you've developed to this point, if you could even, like, distill it down to one thing, really. We always ask this on What's the Story?, and I know it's [00:27:00] a really hard question to ask at the end. Yeah,
Jo Roper: so, I would, I would say, um, one of my I think one of my favourite verses, um, comes from a psalm, um, is seek peace and pursue it.
And I think that has been something that I have strived, not always managed to, but strived to kind of do in all of this and through all of this. So, um, uh, yeah, we, I recently had it tattooed on my foot. Um, but I think it's. It's something that probably isn't my default, um, and, but I really value it when I, when I know that I do it properly, God, God provides it.
And, and I think, um, you know, Jesus says, I'll give you peace that passes all understanding and there are. There are definitely so many moments when we, we won't get the peace. We won't be able to find the peace, um, on our, in our own strength. Um, and so knowing that we can, you know, ask Jesus for it. [00:28:00] And, um, and it will be, yeah, deeper than we can imagine.
It's so important. And I think that the, the really important part is the pursue, because I think you didn't ask, but you've You've got to really seek it, you've really got to want it and to, and to dig deep sometimes because the, because some of life is just so, so heartbreaking, so hard and so it's, it's so important to do that.
Anna Kettle: Yeah. Yeah, and that was Psalm 46, did you say? Yeah. Yeah, I really love that. That's a really nice life motto, and as you say, peace is something that you continually have to pursue in this, particularly in this world, because we're so busy, aren't we, and there's so much going on and coming at us all the time.
Like, it is something you sort of constantly have to wrestle for and keep pursuing. Yeah. It's quite proactive, isn't it? Was there any particular reason why you did it on your foot or were you just like, that's just where I [00:29:00] want to put it? Um,
Jo Roper: I don't know really. I think I, I was, I'm always conscious that it has to be somewhere that I can kind of cover up at work or yeah, yeah, that kind of thing.
And I think, um, I guess pursuing it, to me, sometimes means like moving and doing, yeah, it's like the place where you would find it.
Anna Kettle: Yeah, I was just thinking of, um, you know, um, a passage of scripture where it talks about, um, the armour of God as well, I think it talks about the shoes of peace, um, it's just interesting, isn't it, that actually, biblically, like, peace is something you do when you walk in and you kind of strap on your feet and you have fun.
Moving and choose. Yeah, I think that's really interesting. Yeah. Hmm. Is there anything else, um, you wanted to kind of tell us about or kind of, um, share with us before we wrap up? It's been, I see we've covered a lot of ground in quite a short [00:30:00] space, really.
Jo Roper: Yeah, no, I don't think so. I think, yeah, I just, yeah, I think waiting for children and just being able to support people and yeah, yeah,
Anna Kettle: my passion.
Well definitely we will, um, share all of the contacts sort of in the show notes, so people please do look up Jo, look up the team, that course is brilliant and I highly recommend it. Tell us as well Jo, where can people connect with you? How can they find you? Where's the best place if they, if anything you've talked about today has touched a nerve or people want to kind of Yeah,
Jo Roper: so I've got Instagram, so if you want to message me through Instagram, um, I'm quite good at Getting back to people hopefully, um, and, um, I mean, if you contacted, um, HTB through Waiting for Children, um, then they would, they'd be able to forward it on to me as well, so either way.
And that's
Anna Kettle: just on the HTB website? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so easy to find. And then [00:31:00] also, I guess, through your church, which
Jo Roper: is Fabric? Yes, absolutely. Yeah, I don't have a Fabric email, but, um, yeah, Matt, like, obviously Mark does. Yeah.
Anna Kettle: Yeah. So through the website, it's great. Well, Jo, thank you so much for being here today and sharing a little bit about your heart with us.
It's been really cool to talk to you and just very inspiring to hear how you've, um, personally kind of walked the talk, you know, and, and done something really practical as well to, to just bless somebody in that community. So, um, thank you so much and thanks for, yeah, sharing a bit of yourself with us.
Thanks for having me. See you soon. See you.
Sadaf Beynon: And just like that, we've reached the end of another fascinating conversation. Remember to check out Crowd Online Church at www. crowd. church. Don't forget to subscribe to What's the Story on your favourite podcast app. We've got a treasure trove of inspiring stories coming your way and we'd hate for you to miss any of them.
What's the Story [00:32:00] is a production of Crowd Online Church. Our fantastic team, including Anna Kettle, Matt Edmundson, Tanya Hutsuliak, and myself, Sadaf Beynon, work behind the scenes to bring these stories to life. Our theme song is a creative work of Josh Edmundson. If you're interested in the transcript or show notes, head over to our website, whatsthistorypodcast.
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